General DiscussionMonkey kang

tabbed ka, okitnam

Yeah. The way he dive tower to kill enemy and then just jump away after that i think its shouldn't happen. Maybe tower dmg should disable tree dance?

I'm just sick of seeing him picked/banned every single game in the first tournament he isn't banned in, it's because his movement and vision is OP and on top of that he can scale, there's no reason to pick another roaming support other than him

Especially after months of people saying he was perfectly balanced lul

44% winrate in all brackets ???
took 1 sec of focusing to evaporate?
no armor?
need levels?
need items to scale which is bad for support when play from behind?
4 sec built in self-stun lul ?
ogre mage can dive towers at lvl 1 ?
high skill cap?

each hero must have what make him good enough

@The Rider

what does winrate have to do with anything when the pros are clearly showing the hero is OP when used correctly

Invoker has a bad winrate too yet he's absolutely dominating this tournament and is consistently picked/banned and (from what I've seen) performs incredibly well

yeah but people don't ask to nerf him since he already nerfed enough

this game is suppose to reward skill

30%slow in 4sec is op. It used to be 40 but oh well.ez lv 1 kill in every lane high bat for lv 1

pudge 30% slow + potential deny ?
jugg highest magical damage skill lvl one and the highest first blood potential?
life stealer slow 70% over 8 seconds ?
slark W 3.5 not running baby ?
pa 50% slow that scale like hell ?

the only logic i see to nerf him is that he is new
wait until we have another new hero and people would talk how mk balanced ?

name me 1 (one) hero who gives as much vision and mobility as monkey king and who can also scale

this game is suppose to reward skill

is this logical statement,what is the point of adding mk if there is a hero already provide everything that he have ?

i can literally say the same about every single hero in dota since they are supposed to be unique

name me one hero who can give you as much chase potential, spellcasters shut down , ratting and ulti that scale lie anti mage?
name me one hero that can provide he team with global mana regain while having strong disables and a devastating team fight ulti as cm?
name me one hero that can provide stun,slow,ulti that reveal and shred every body armor while being able to offlane (slarder) ?

there is no such hero that do exact the same shit as another because this is not lol

It just his lv 1 is very strong. He is by far the strongest lv1 hero in the game

mobility and vision arent specific things like global mana regen rofl
they're the most important early games aspects a roamer can have

what makes riki es and bounty special, monkey has all of it and more
there is no reason to pick a roamer other than monkey and the proof is that the pros are constantly picking/banning him

Hey guys, there is a hero that can turn himself into a courier and walk past enemy towers and snipe the courier

Mk is insanely OP. A lot of what he offers in terms of vision and the ability to courier snipe as well as mischeif plays are not used at all in lower brackets hence the low win rates. Outside the pro scene and very high MMR players most people are not utilising the hero correctly. The hero also has a much higher skill cap that people think.

isn't mk vision reduced when he jump on trees ?

ogre,pudge,es are still super strong roamer with slow and skills that scale late game (hook - agha, bloodlust-agha , all stuns and silence along side agha es) and decent tankiness

BH and riki are not picked much rn but they still provide a different types of vision (and BH ulti is broken af in snowball teams and very good for engaging/disengaging)

riki have silence and slow in one skill+util that also scale late game and force enemy supports to buy more vision which destroy their item timing

yeah mk is super good in skilled hands i don't want any hero to get nerfed because good players knows how to use him good because that means that after nerf even good player cant use him=complete trash hero

Mk is also a very versatile pick he can both secure the safe lanes farm as one of if not the best zoners in the game level 1 as well providing extremely potent gank potential with leap as having the best potential to sniper the courier of any support in the game as well as having an amazing mid/ late game with wukongs command.

@only offlane

he have 46% winrate in 5k+ bracket means that if he is in the enemy team you will win against him more that you will lose and that is enough reason not to nerf him even more

just like Arc who could use rapiers on double
had 45% winrante
didn't need nerf
Kappa

Mk vision isn't reduced when he jumps on trees its only reduced at night on a tree. Its not so much about the vision he provides in the late / midgame he isnt a roaming ward its the mobility and his ability to not be visible just sat on a tree and then suddenly out of nowhere activate ult into 2 second stun into perma bash from skull basher.

@the rider I have a near 80% winrate on Mk trust me the hero is OP

Yea I agree w bws. Imagine if viper was top pick. You'd want to kil yourself I'm sure. But pa is kinda nice to watch in pro games

arc after all this nerfs still maintain 50% winrate in 5k+ so he probably deserved most of them

People just haven't worked out how to properly utilise most of MKs skill set yet. The skill-cap is way higher than people think honestly.

@only offlane

i am sure that some 5k+ would have the same winrate on invoker/tinker/visage

you use the hero to his full potential which is reward worthy

anyway we will know the accurate statistics after this tournament and if his winrate is high he would cucked again :)

Ppl havent started to even buy a blink dagger on him. W8 till ppl buy blink. Also how many times i said this but mk is the best lv1 hero in the game

Volvo nerfing wisp every damn patch while tried to make shallow pubstomping heroes like PA relevant LUL

some one have to be best lvl 1 :)

imagine if mk doesn't exist we would complain that es/juggernaut/may be BH would be the best lvl 1 hero and that is not enough to nerf them

no one has ever complained about those heroes at lvl1

monkey is the first hero who everyone agrees is fucking impossible to kill so long as he doesn't jump into a ward at lvl1

the fact is that MK in his current state makes heroes like ES useless
why pick ES when monkey is just so much better at roaming (other than your player being better at ES which happens)

@the rider
You can guarantee lv 1 kill on enemy midlaner if
-no supp on mid
-enemy midlaner hug tower
Get how fucking op this hero is?
Compare with other hero is there any hero who can kill enemy midlaner with that little condition to kill enemy midlaner? Es cannot kill enemy mid lv 1 if he dont perfectly fissure and can be counter with ward
Bh you can just walk out of it because no jindana
Mirana need to land arrow and need to be at the back of enemy midlaner to have the highest possibility that he dont see your arrow
Jugg spin from 600 range away???

ES (earth spirit) still picked almost every game and he have longer disable in teamfights , mk evaporate in team fights until like lvl 20
ES (earth shaker) need only on item the whole game and can make a game changing plays with fissure

earth spirit was picked less than half as often as monkey in the DAC

also monkey evaporate in teamfights? he's more durable than es, has more damage and more reliable stun, as well as the ability to stay near the fight without being seen

so a roaming mk can secure kill on a midlaner that hug tower while ogre cant ?

different heroes have different advantages and disadvantages

you have very good roamer that have slow , long range stun , scaling ulti yet he is super squishy , high skill cap , need items and lvls , can make misplays easily , cant run away if he is damaged , his vision on trees is reduced and have almost useless passive and i find a balanced support

if he is super broken in pro hands he would have a higher winrate in their bracket

i am perfectly fine with a new hero to be showed in pro games and that will always happen and happened with every new hero

juggernaut is in every game , invoker is almost every game does that make them broken

yes mk is better roamer but dota is not a roaming game, in other aspects other heroes does better

invoker won 6 games and lost 1 in the DAC
he also just won igv vs empire (with top networth) in the last match despite dying 5 times in 10 minutes
he is also pretty broken in this patch

Ogre dont start at hitting enemy in melee range ok? Mk is a better roaming hero until lv 6. He is compareable in tf with es but i think es is better in midgame pickoff and skirmishes.

ogre can throw his W then dive the fountain if needed :) with his midlaner to kill you

ogre is super tankey and don't need a single item after brown boot to be effective the whole game unlike mk

The Rider just gonna argue all day...

Mk is strong lvl 1 but having 0 starting armor makes me think he isnt the strongest. I wud say ogre is stronger but mk is more useful

I dont think mk needs a huge nerf, probably just so that u cant leap if u take tower dmg and that the slow lasts 3 seconds or smth

why no one complaining about his ult? :(