General DiscussionEver had a 30k Gold loss

tbh with techies and dusa late game is hard so bad execution for not taking the game while advantage is still there

or just cant end the game at all

meh

Winning that game wase quite easy.

Don't push, just farm dominator and take bunch of ursa/centaure.

When you'll reach 15 of them, you'll have 65% magic resistance on every heroes (96.5% on creep).

And then a+ click their base. You don't care about techies anymore. medusa ain't a threat either, cause you'll have plenty of creep to tank the split shot. (and anyway, between void and underlord, no reason to fear that 0 dps snake.

If ever they had some cleave (like ember) yeah you can tell techies to go die, but else, it just mean you played without your brain on.
They could not go out, or they woulda lose the fight, uknow? no matter which state of the game.

that's the xp chart

techies a.k.a. the best late game hero in the game

it happens with low execution all the time, I am pretty sure you aren't the only one or the last one with this to happen

well considering i had cancer team mates, who couldnt hit chrono's or de ward. It makes life pretty difficult, I spent the majority of my ultis and manta illus pressuring towers and demining.

I had 5k X hp and would just tank mines and stuff, however WW stomps CK and the fact of never being able to teamfight due to KOTL blasts, mines everywhere and dusa killing my illus. Breaching highround was abit impossible.

The thing about 0 dps dusa's, is she press's R and i lose all my illus, that and the WW can one hit me with his ulti.

@matrice, yeah we were farming the whole map, till my void got caught and died. I was doing naga style cutting off creepwaves, but They managed to get a wave to mid where void diedback. and well, we got GG pushed

not sure, maybe i'm just horrid at CK, as he farms like a brick.
still never know when to go bfury on him, midas seems nice, but CK likes his slots, so not sure.

situationally, that hero is insanely strong. However randoming him first pick, with X counters, that hero gets punished hard.

Nice disclaimers lul.

What senpai said;

you played without your brain on

Like matrice says, sometimes the way to win is not to push at all, and play with your brain turned on.

http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2627001737

1hr 20mins of slowly guiding my team to a win, don't chase kills, don't do anything but sit in your base and wait for creep waves. Plan when you push, a wipe doesn't mean a push sometimes.

Took so many mistakes to get the team to win this game right despite it being a lost game from 5 mins.

We were the offence, wasn't really planning to push, we got picked. and well, after getting picked. You're now on defence.
Without sentries or my gem carrier, i couldnt step up highground to pressure, as the techies was base sitting since 30mins, which created Nukes in the highground.

Kotl nuke/aghs clears any creepwave that gets close, so there was no chance at backdooring either.

Game was hard.

I've won from the return position alot of times, and in that similar position.
however, i'm fairly sure we got out drafted. it just took far too long to findout

Why did you build linkens on a game where they have like one single target spell with ww's ulty? You should've got bkb, use ur manta illusions to kill techies regulard physical dmg mines then run up with bkb and kill the tower before it wears off, his ultimate mines can't touch you.

Actually that looks like the more realistic reason you lost, no one on your team has bkb pushing high ground vs techies, sf, kotl and ww. That's a shitton of magic dmg coming your way.

Potentially, it could have been the wrong choice, i tossed up between them both.
I got Linkens because Winter wyvern was stomping us, i got killed twice i believe as soon as i ulti'd i'd get WW Ultied and then i just got pumped.
That and midgame manaleak made me a sad pony.

Fyi diffusal not very good on void without manta, the two go hand in hand.

yeah void and lc's builds are bad too, heart satanic lc over bkb, deso, abyssal. I mean idk, maybe that's better shit ultra late game, maybe satanic is needed, but deso scales well into late since armor is better the more hp you have.

No blink on void, mjollnir but you don't need wave clear vs their team, no manta for diffusal.

Or you maybe could've dropped mkb and linkens for two more hearts and just sent illusions to towers. 3 heart illusions take a lot of mines to kill.

dire wolf

deso is best against low armor heroes

not high armor heroes...

satanic is good ultra late, but satanic and heart without abyssal is BAD unless ur team is some shit like pitlord + lion + puck

holy shit pitlord + puck is probably the most legit combo in the game actually

the red mines werent an issue, i clear'd them everytime manta was off cd.
The Kotl blind on my illusions with Aghs vision so they could track them, and the SF or dusa would just dps them down.

Satanic could have been nice yes, but once again, the WW Cold embrace was really, really giving me issues. Especially with the 1v9 style dota, where my LC wouldnt jump the WW and my void couldnt jump a fly.

I think in heinsight Bkb could have been better, however theres always that risk of getting cursed on the highground and then they setup for a dusa ulti and or mines.

Massing hearts maybe, i had armlet in that slot for a long time untill i could afford a full MKB with BB, as armlet value is rediculous with the Illu spam. it was only really when i had to buyback, that i dropped my armlet for the MKB because instead of sieging, i had to fight. And i figured that was the best 'fighting' item for the dusa, as that guy with Cold embrace was a raid boss.

That's not what I said, I said armor is more valuable the more hp you have, so stripping 7 armor off a 1000 hp target drops their ehp 42% which is 420, vs a 500 hp target it only drops 210.

And that's a fallacy that armor reduction is better vs squishy targets. Armor increases ehp by a percentage so it's all percents, doesn't matter if it's going from 10 armor to 0 or 20 to 10, the amount of ehp stripped off is the same.

Let's do an example so it makes sense. Pretend you do 100 dmg a hit. Target has 1000 hp for easy numbers and 10 armor or ehp of 1600. It takes you 16 hits to kill it. Dropping armor to 3 gives ehp of 1180, takes you 12 hits to kill it, or 4 less.

Same target has 20 armor, ehp of 2200. 22 hits to kill it. At 13 armor it's ehp is 1780, takes you 18 hits to kill it, 4 less. It's exactly the same.

The reason you think it's a bigger dps increase vs the softer target is cus comparatively it takes you 25% less hits to kill the squishy target vs 18% less on the more armored target but in the end the amount of time/hits to kill it is reduced by exactly the same. Ok so with deso and ac and slardar ult you 1 shot a support that's a pretty cool feeling, but reality is you probably 2 shot them without those debuffs, and you now 5 shot a carry vs 8 or 10 shot a carry.

so taking 25% less hits to kill vs taking 18% less hits to kill is the same thing to u. cool

buy deso against morphling or dk and see how effective the damage amp is

lvl 1 treant with medallion kills level 13 axe in 14 hits vs 20

the same axe with 2 platemails takes 42 hits vs 48

that's a huge fucking difference