General Discussion

General Discussionis it just me or is treads losing relevance vs other boots?

is it just me or is treads losing relevance vs other boots? in General Discussion
Dog

    to me it kinda feels like it lacks so much movespeed and attack speed for its cost. attribute-switching seems to lack utility now vs phase boots' phase ability and passive regen and bonus movespeed from tranq. what do you think?

    Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

      for me its the exact opposite. i basically only build treads/bot because i think pahse/tranq are useless on most heroes

      TripleSteal-

        @spunki
        u dont play on the heroes that use tranquils and phase boots

        @op
        ye kinda. there was a period within the last year when u used to build pt for literally all the heroes including invoker, gyro, duza etc., not the itemization meta changed to its original state, more or less.

        Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

          yeah i'm thinking about meta heroes and no supports

          Dog

            even from a carry standpoint, I think I'd rather have phase boots + windlace for good measure. exceptions would be AM, a mid-game active SF, basically a few other semi carry mid heroes that could use the attribute switch and some with built in phase

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            Seven-

              come to think of it i even build phase on brood and lc

              doesnt affect me tho since i mostly play offlaners and supports lel

              Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                terrorblade? morph? void? jug?

                i prefer treads/bot on all of them. the only hero i'd build phase on is sniper, and even then it depends on the lane.

                but i guess its just mostly a matter of taste

                Stickman

                  @spunki your inventory is literally tp scroll and brown boots, why are you defending treads. Feeder?

                  Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                    because this is not my main account

                    Filthy

                      Jugg should use phase over treads for sure .

                      Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                        idk im building treads at least 70% of the time and im doing good, imo its way better than phase

                        ofc phase is cool with bladefury/omni but there's more than that

                        Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                          but again its just a matter of how you build your hero and what goals you ahve in ur game. I usually build blink & sny so i got enough ms that the phase boots don't give me anything post 20 min

                          matrice

                            Terrorblade go for tread only for hp, but it doesn't count, it's an illusion carry.

                            Tread are awfull on morph, he doesn't have the movespeed to hit, you leave it brown.

                            Phase boot is better than tread on jugg, FAR better.
                            Void has bash + chrono + a low cd jump, so yeah tread's better.

                            It's more or less :

                            ranged carry/ultra mobile mele carry --> tread
                            mele carry --> phase boot

                            With exception of illusion carry +morph + ember, those can go a bit wild.
                            And depending on your game plan, gyro and luna are great with phase or tread.

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                            Filthy

                              I never really played gyro but treads is actually viable on him?

                              sin blyadi

                                PT still the best boots

                                Aurora-

                                  Hm, interesting tread, however, dbuff has some stats concerning pt and pb. There you can clearly see great winrate difference between pt and pb on particular heroes (sometimes >3%). The most obvious examples are Sven (PT), jugg (pb), pa (pb), dusa (pb).

                                  Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                                    you should not go by this logic because it only cares about the items u had in ur inventory by the ned of the game

                                    so you might as well say that you should always buy BoT first item because hey, it got a 70% winrate.

                                    one syllable anglo-saxon

                                      it's irrelevant not because it counts your end items(players usually choose between treads or phase so if it's in ur end inventory u probably went for them when they were relevant) but because it counts matches from potato bracket which form the statistic because there are way more potato bracket matches than any other

                                      YB^^

                                        What boots should you build on riki? I've seen all 3 being used

                                        Eternal Meow

                                          Is there a reason some supports will buy the power treads instead of mana boots? I understand why they buy tranquils if they can regen their own mana, but a lot of supports buy power treads when mana would have been more useful to the team.

                                          Dire Wolf

                                            But matrice, sven, wraith king, dragon knight, drow, those guys almost always build treads and none of them are mobile unless they get blink daggers or shadow blades, which blink is pretty core on sven and wk. So I'm not sure that's a hard and fast rule.

                                            Androgynous

                                              "a lot of supports buy power treads"
                                              then you're playing with idiots. supports dont need attack speed and tread switching efficiency rarely comes into effect because their only source of regen is magic wand most cases whereas mids and some carries will get bottle.

                                              plus supports are often so underlevelled that the extra 50 hp or whatever you'd get from tread switching with wand isn't going to make a difference whether you die or not, and for mana arcanes are far better even if you never use it on your teammates, plus give a bit more speed.

                                              Androgynous

                                                YB

                                                not a riki player but most are going phase because as a roamer you're going to be moving around the map often and riki's starting speed is shit, with treads ur trading that speed for a marginal dps bonus that in actual games either won't matter or the loss of speed actually ends up losing you attack uptime and therefore dps.

                                                tranquils also can work cos they give you speed and sustain although obviously much worse late cos attacking loses the speed bonus (though it's still 10 more than treads) and u dont have as much damage. i think they're still better than treads though.

                                                maybe in a few games treads are superior to phase but you'd win more games building phase every game than building treads cos phase are better in more situations.

                                                even as a safe lane carry riki which is out of favour right now, phase would stilly be better cos a riki is gonna be looking for solo kills rather than afk farming the entire game

                                                M u r d e r

                                                  But Treads are exceptionally powerful on Riki as he gains extra damage... And if you don't roam pre-yasha, have slowing items, they will probably be best by far (since you buy Blink Dagger anyway haha)... But that's the thing, most Rikis roam and need cheap MS bonus to get around the map.

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                                                  Pale Mannie

                                                    I buy tranquills on riki and i still deal damage to everyone with my diffusal

                                                    MARLAN

                                                      h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l h i g h s k i l l

                                                      anyway.

                                                      i had an ursa buy power treads in my game today :')

                                                      http://www.dotabuff.com/matches/2535596259

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                                                      senior professional griefer

                                                        treads are great for mana management and situational tankiness.

                                                        actually its phase boots which have become irrelevant due to the active nerf. it's a damage item more than anything else...

                                                        but yeah, extra 10ms on treads is something i'd like do see.

                                                        Dire Wolf

                                                          if treads get a ms buff NO ONE will buy phase, they already got nerfed once. It's fine as is.

                                                          MARLAN

                                                            the only change i'd expect is a slight buff to tranquils.

                                                            probably decrease the break CD

                                                            M u r d e r

                                                              Tranquils are very cheap and yet they may be considered as best boots for some heroes... So no I dont think they need to be buffed.

                                                              BlurryBob

                                                                For me every chance-based hero (Jugg, Sniper, Void, PA, Troll) needs PT. Others depend upon the situation

                                                                Dog

                                                                  ^except sniper gets kited (or worse, raped) without movespeed

                                                                  Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                                                                    ^thats why u want to build blink, forcestaff, yasha ...

                                                                    Dire Wolf

                                                                      Who the fuck builds treads on troll? And almost no one builds them on jug either, 6.3 million phase boots compared to 300k treads. PA I was surprised, more people are building treads on her than phase, 4.6 million treads to 3.8 million phase. And sniper people still more than double treads, 3.5 to 1.4 million treads to phase. I almost always build phase on sniper and pa.

                                                                      Â INV MENYA LP PARTY

                                                                        i only build phase on troll, otherwise everythings treads including juggernaut

                                                                        so i guess its just a matter of how you play / what you like / your playstyle since i'm doing as well with treads as im doing well with phases on jug

                                                                        Aurora-

                                                                          Spunki, in most cases dbuff stats even from 'potato' bracket represent some game logic behind boots choice, just look at the heroes:
                                                                          Gyro: obvious phases, has only 5 shots from flak to deliver his attack dmg. Attack speed is irrelevant. Also requires movespeed for barrage.
                                                                          Medusa: also the number of shots is not limited, like in gyros case, needs ms to deliver shots when ppl run away
                                                                          Ursa, wr, troll- maximum attack speed already
                                                                          PA - dagger deals dmg based on ur attack dmg + needs ms after phantom strike
                                                                          Etc

                                                                          Filthy

                                                                            Potato bracket builds most treads . You see less treads on heros like jugger and pa as u move up in mmr .

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